cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/18475086
I’m not against those who work for sex, but the idea to earn for a living doesn’t seem nice. IMO, sex should be for 2 people (or more for others who prefer polyamory) who wants to be intimate/romantic with each other. My point is money should not be the purpose.
Work is work. It deserves every bit of respect and protection as anything else.
Sex work is work.
The people that do it deserve respect, and all the social and legal protections that attach to any other kind of work.
Your own preferred attitude to sex isn’t the point.
But should it be work?
Should we really have a society where selling your body is an opportunity to make money.
For instance, it imply that some poor women are gonna take it regardless the consequence, just because it’s the best alternative to pay the bills.
I can barely tolerate the physical straining we put on some workers. Sex work’s consequences are unacceptable to me in that same sens, sometimes worse.
So sure, no matter your opinion we should respect them, and not incriminate them!
And of course not all sex work is the same… to be acceptable it just requires better conditions. It can’t be something you choose out of need.
For instance, it imply that some poor women are gonna take it regardless the consequence, just because it’s the best alternative to pay the bills.
How is this principally different from a poor person taking any shitty job to pay the bills? Like garbage collector or similarly unpleasant/disrespected jobs. The system always forces poor people to settle for shitty jobs. Sex work is not the issue there, the system is.
It’s different in nature. No other jobs infringe on your intimacy in this way.
I do agree the system is the problem, i also would advocate for better conditions for any difficult jobs.
Therapist, hospice, nursing , sports medicine, massage… a lot of jobs require some level of physical or mental intimacy.
Therapist is another topic, with problems of mental intimacy indeed.
The rest is the patient’s intimacy that you have to deal with. It is a vastly different intimate experience to wash a genitalia and be penetrated. And so, vastly different consequences for your well being.
selling your body
i hate that phrasing to describe sex work. no one is “selling their body”, as they are still in control of it. sex workers provide a service, same as a masseuse or hair stylist (except their service involves genitals) and it should be treated as such.
Otherwise one could argue that all (physical) labour is “selling your body”
It is a high risk job along the lines of coal mining and such, since it will result in an increase in transmitted disease risk. It’s important to acknowledge that, but I am on the side of it being work. I just think we need strong protections in place and regulations to handle it akin to other dangerous jobs. Like, a sex work branch of OSHA.
I think the “body” in that expression is quite specifically referring to genitals, or the selling of your intimacy.
Because that’s what’s different from any other physical labour, the part of your body involved. That’s the specific problem of sex work no?
It seems to me like joining the military is arguably more deserving of the phrase “selling your body”; you’re basically signing up to get injured or killed.
Regulations would help, but create their own hurdles.
True and tested.
The best help is probably indirectly having better social policies overall. Although never perfect, the best we are the lesser the problem.
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Like most people say here, if that’s something you want to do that’s all good so long as you’re protected by law and workers’ rights and all that jazz. Personally, though, I don’t really understand it. I mean, why would anybody want to do this with all the risks (rape, diseases)? I’m open to receiving perspectives and education, currently I just don’t really “get” it.
Yes
When I see that I think both should be illegal.
At least that’s a consistent viewpoint. What I despise is demonizing sex work but not exploitative labor practices. It’s totally illogical to me that people will pride themselves on working 12+ hour days, skip breaks, come in on days off, work nights and weekends and holidays, etc but look down on people who have an OnlyFans or whatever. I don’t really understand criticizing one without the other.
Personally, I don’t give a shit about sex work. If it were fully legal and workers were protected and everything, I still don’t know that I would pay for it, but I sure as shit wouldn’t fight to take that choice away from others. It just wouldn’t really affect me. Same thing for access to safe drugs or abortions. I’m not going to advocate for other people to not have choices in their personal freedoms, so I guess I’ll fight for people to have access even for things I’m not that interested in for myself.
Thats what it takes, and what we lack today - fighting for personal choice even when we dont like one or more of them.
Instead today people harp about freedom until you even scratch the surface and find out they mean the freedom to make the same choices they did and none other.
Oh I agree with you on sex work in the present day. I just go a step further for the future. People should work because they want to, not have to. The value of a person’s work should not determine the value of the person. One thing I do wonder though. If we didn’t have to work, many people still would because they enjoy the work. Would people do sex work in that situation? If they want to, I support thier right to do so. But it was a thought that came to me reading this post, that I haven’t fully explored in my head yet.
Excellent question. Idk, I can see indirect sex work like camming or porn still happening because that could be connected to a desire to perform for an audience. Maybe less prostitution but I’m almost certain that it wouldn’t go away completely.
Well, I suppose by the time we no longer have to work for a living, we will easily have extremely good sex robots. So it will probably be an irrelevant question.
Yes, as long as everyone involved is consenting. It needs to be destigmatized especially in healthcare settings.
Totally fine, work is work, you decide what you want to do with your life and if that fills the gap more power to you.
We need more regulation though, like Amsterdam where if you’re working you have to get weekly check ups, and psychological counseling should be freely available.
Sex work is a good industry but it also harbors trafficking which needs to be cracked down on hard.
Sex isn’t special in the sense of being on a pedestal. Sure, it can be magical in that two people in love come closer together, but that is also true of many intimate experiences. The physical act should not be restricted from being performed, shared, or even monetized because of the sense of morality of others.
Sex workers are working. They may get someone off via their actions, but they’re providing a service, same as someone who fixes your broken phone, provides medical care, or unclogs your toilet. It’s a form of labor.
My life doesn’t include a special realm or being beyond that of people to provide incentives or guidance on how to live. That’s entirely decided by people and their own sense of decency. Treat others well, as you’d wish to be treated, and try not to live in a way that negatively affects others. That’s the whole of morality to me. I think this will lead to a good life. In no way would paying for or receiving money for sexual acts be affected by it.
Hell, give me enough money and I’ll perform whatever sex acts you want.
Not really. I’ve never paid for a prostitute, I’ve never gone to a single strip club in my life or anything. I’ve only read the horror stories of what porn actors had gone through and it’s really not a sustainable way of living.
Sex should be treated as just a consenting activity between two or more people where nobody has to be hurt or wronged in any way for doing.
There’s a lot of variables and unchecked liabilities involved when it comes to treating sex as like a job.
See, I wasn’t really sure, but I think this thread has helped convince me that it’s probably okay. I was for sex work before, but then I had heard that countries with more lax sex work laws had more human trafficking. But that might just be a result of work in our moder capitalist hellscape. Part of me thinks sex work should be illegal until capitalist is abolished, but part of that is probably just some ingrained puritan attitudes of sex and personal philosophy about its intimacy. It doesn’t mean the state should ban people from selling it and it doesn’t mean I have to partake if it’s legal.
I’ll probably keep reading this thread to evolve my attitudes on the subject more, but thanks everyone for the interesting comments on a subject I don’t think about much (sex work… Sex itself I think about all the time lol).
Work is work.
Is sex work selling your body? Is doing masonry carpentry or road fixing work anything less than that?
Is sex work ethical? Is working for a weapon manufacture ethical?
I think the point on sex work is a different one: exploitation. That is wrong and should not be allowed or tolerated. But is it avoidable?
The focus should not be on the sex workers tough, but on the clients. The sex workers will always be there as long as there is demand for them.
So, yes, give sex workers the opportunity to work in a safe and not abused environment, so that it can be a choice like any other work. Which means, legalize, regulate, and so on.
If you believe that laws forbidding gambling, sale of liquor, sale of contraceptives, requiring definite closing hours, enforcing the Sabbath, or any such, are necessary to the welfare of your community, that is your right and I do not ask you to surrender your beliefs or give up your efforts to put over such laws. But remember that such laws are, at most, a preliminary step in doing away with the evils they indict. Moral evils can never be solved by anything as easy as passing laws alone. If you aid in passing such laws without bothering to follow through by digging in to the involved questions of sociology, economics, and psychology which underlie the causes of the evils you are gunning for, you will not only fail to correct the evils you sought to prohibit but will create a dozen new evils as well.
—Robert A. Heinlein, Take Back Your Government
Yep. There is definitely a strong market for it. And i firmly believe it alleviates tensions enough to prevent a lot of assaults
Very cool to steal the arguments pedophiles use to justify what’s on their hard drives.
If only there were some way to judge if the pornographization of society had led to more assaults and trafficking 🤔
Pretty bold talk for someone who setup a snitch line lol. But it’s a good phrase to follow. Unfortunately lots of people use it when they’re engaging in felonious levels of criminal behavior on a corporate and government level. Hating regulation, wanting small small small government - it’s all because they want to engage in exploitative, unethical, toxic and criminal business practices and they want the government to fuck off about it.
But I digress lol :-)
I believe a victimless crime shouldn’t be, and that unless a very strong case is made otherwise for a specific person, people can decide what they want for themselves.
Of course people being forced into sex work is bad, but then so is people being forced into working kitchens or call centers. If they decide on it voluntarily that’s all good and well.
Also, since I can’t resist:
approve of sex workapprove sex workYes, it’s my job to personally rubber stamp every truck stop girl. /s
