Explanations/etymology also appreciated!
For Joe Shmoe, it means a very average or below average person. It’s a derivation of the practice of using “shm-” to dismiss something (eg “Practice shmactice. We’re already perfect”).
And “John Smith” is meant to be the most average name or person imaginable, so they have the “most common” (citation needed) first and last name as well.
In the Netherlands, it’s either “Jan Smit” (both a very common first and last name, but also a local celebrity’s name) or “Henk de Vries” which IIRC is the most common name here.
I also vaguely remember some old Dutch forum naming everyone Henk de Vries by default.
Flemish talking part of Belgium it is Jan Janssen
In Norway we have “Ola Nordmann” and “Kari Nordmann”. Ola and Kari are pretty common and generic names. Nordmann literally means Norwegian, but can also be used as a last name.
We have the phrase ‘every Tom, Dick and Harry’ which is like that (UK)
If we’re talking about a generic person it’s usually Mr/s Smith or Mr/s Jones (near Wales)
Yeah we do :)
In Australia we have Joe Bloggs, but it sounds English. Do you have him in England?
In the Netherlands there’s “Jan Modaal”, modaal (modal) referring the most commonly occurring value in or peak of a distribution. This name is used often when representing the experience of the most average Dutchman.
It’s especially often used in financial discussions and journalism, like “owning a house is getting further out of reach for Jan Modaal.”
We also have the slur of “sjonnie en anita” when talking about lower class, anti social people, “sjonnie” being the man and “anita” the woman. Both are very common names in older generations, less common in younger generations.
Ingrid en Henk, too, for the run of they mill boomer stereotype
Which correlates nicely with the English expression “your average Joe”!
Denmark -
Brian <- A name, but also a slur for people considered ‘hillbilly’. Very frequently used against people who drive cheap tuner hatchbacks. Said cars can be referred to as Brian Cars.
Peter Jensen <- Also a name, but it’s become notorious in Jutland because it feels like everyone is immediately related to someone with this exact first and last name.
Interesting. In the UK (at least when I was growing up, I haven’t lived there for some time) we called doing up shit cars as Barry-ing them. I know in other parts of the country they used the name Ned or Kev to refer to the people that drove those cars.
I can’t tell you how much I love that Denmark has hillbillys who drive hatchbacks and are called fuckin’ Brian as a slur.
I think more generally people use " hr. og fru Jensen" for a more exact analog of “John/Jane Smith”
But Peter Jensen was the most common name in Denmark for many years, so you’re not completely wrong.
so what do you just go ‘du er brian!’ lmfao
Used that way it would be " du er en Brian"
jeg er en sej brian og du er en brain
In the UK it is Joe Bloggs
Also Fred Bloggs in Australia — maybe they’re related?
In Germany there is “Max Mustermann”, which basically translates to Max Template-man. It’s the default German name used for templates of official documents like passports and such.
In German there are also derogatory uses for the forenames “Kevin” and “Otto” for example. Often used to depict not well educated persons that have made extremely stupid decisions/choices.
As someone with a brother named Kevin, I can confirm he’s doing his part to uphold that depiction.
Don’t forget his wife, Erika Mustermann, geb. (née) Gabler. She’s usually the one used for passports these days. I think there’s a whole Mustermann family living in these templates.
Isn’t it Erika Musterfrau?
Sometimes, but I mostly see her name as Mustermann.
Or for historical context: “der Deutsche Michel” - “the German Michael “
Don’t forget Otto Normalverbraucher. Nobody cares about Otto Normalverbraucher.
In my country (Spanish speaking) we say “Fulano de tal” Fulano is kinda like a template name nobody really is named like that. “De tal” really means something like “from somewhere”.
We dont out it on the graves, but we use it as slang for situations where we need to refer to someone generic like “imagine a fulano de tal doing xxxxxxxxxxx”.
There are other names like Zutano, Mengano, etc.
Edit: My mom sometimes uses “Miguel Perez”. Those 2 are very common first and last names.
And “Zé das Couves” (but this one is used more rarely).
There’s something similar in Italian, Tal dei Tali. Literally something like that one of those ones
Does this came from arabic influence?
To refer someone without a name or generic name we sometime say Fulan bin Fulan meaning someone the son of someone
A lot of Spanish words and culture come from Arabic influences, the iberic peninsula was under control of arabs on the VIII century.
In Poland typically, both officially and informally, one says N. N. (Latin nomen nescio, identity unknown).
What the hell, dude? No one says that. Aren’t you thinking of a John Doe?
Polish “John Smith” would be “Jan Kowalski”. It is used to refer to an average citizen and also literally means “John Smith”.
Fair point, I assumed OP meant people of indeterminate identity. Jan Kowalski is indeed the goto placeholder name.
Some others in the Anglosphere:
Fred Bloggs - no idea where it’s from. Related to “bog” as in bog standard maybe?
Tom, Dick and Harry - is ages old. Even as far back as Shakespeare you can see the triplet evolving. “Tom, Dicke, and Francis” : Henry IV, Part I
I’ve always heard it as Joe Bloggs. The Bloggs bot is believed to be a derivation of bloke
Australian here, Joe Bloggs is very common here.
France: Martin Dupont
But I prefer Dominique Dupont as the first name is both for men and women.
I remember, in this movie Inglorious Basterds, the woman and her family were called
Dupontaswell
Not to stifle further discussion, but this Wikipedia page has a wealth of examples
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_placeholder_names_by_language
Amazing, Ive been learning German for 8 years and just had a great laugh!
I’d attest to that Juan de la Cruz for the most generic Filipino name. de la Cruz still works as a very common surname though I don’t think Juan is still used as much as back then.
And then there are the placeholder phrases, all of which I’ve heard and used.
Uy, ku’nin mo ang ano, yung kuan, iyon! Ay, ano nga ba ang tawag d’yan? Noong ninety kopong-kopong pa namin binili iyan kina ano… Ano nga ba’ng pangalan niya?
In Norway we have the stereotypical Norwegians “Ola Nordmann” and “Kari Nordmann”. Ola and Kari were quite common names a couple generations ago (not so common now). “Nordmann” literally translates to “Norwegian [person]”, but is also a not-too-uncommon last name.
We typically talk about them if we’re describing something or some situation and what the stereotypical Norwegian would do/think.
